Ender's Shadow: Leader and Victor

First off, guys, I'm really sorry, I had tons of stuff going on with the end of the school year and it seemed like no one was commenting, so I completely spaced getting the posts up, and now I've just been guilty of slacking. So let's just finish off the book, for those who were waiting, and move on.

Leader and Victor chronicle Bean finally learning something about human interaction in the face of becoming responsible for a group and having to put it together, feeling truly guilty and grieved when he is unable to protect Ender from Bonzo's assault in the bathroom, and ultimately winning the battle for Ender when Ender has decided he's finished. Bean becomes a toon leader, faces down his own nemesis, Achilles, and goes along with all the other chosen pupils to Tactical and finally to Command school, meanwhile dabbling in political epistolary as he writes to Peter and Valentine regarding his theories about the situation on Earth. He fights the battles of the Third Invasion, is given the chance to take full command from Ender, refuses it, and realizes what Ender knew that he has never understood, and why he could not destroy the Buggers as Ender could. The end, as Bean comes home to the family he never knew he had, knowing he left Ender behind, seems happy and sweet, but given the political situation he has studied while in space, we know there will be more to come.

Final thoughts on Ender and Bean as two protagonists viewed in parallel? Thoughts on the different take each story took, and the different information we were given throughout each one? Thoughts on how the boys handled the attempted manipulation by the teachers differently, and the differences in how they faced the potentially life-threatening challenges that Graff threw at them? Thoughts on Graff and Sister Carlotta, the two adults most present and most able to manipulate both boys' lives? Any other comments, of course, are welcome, and anyone who's willing can suggest the next book.

Ender's Shadow: Soldier

So I was waiting for folks to catch up and post, and then I completely spaced because it had been a while, and I figure I'll just put up the new discussion and people can post as they're ready or thinking about it. So, we've already seen all this from Ender's point of view, and now we get to see it from the other side, also knowing that Bean was the one who assembled this army to become what it was. Bean starts to feel resentful of Ender, and starts to realize how little he really knows about social skills and interaction, knowing so much about Ender only to realize that Ender knows nothing about him. He starts to become more sensitive to Nikolai's feelings, experiences real fear and nervousness, and gradually gains confidence in himself as a part of a group. Finally, having grown a bit as a soldier and as a friend, he gains what he desires: a leadership role in Ender's army.

Meanwhile, Sister Carlotta has learned a lot about Bean and who he is and where he came from, and the news foretells a grim future.

Since we saw a great deal of this from Ender's point of view, I'd love to hear what you guys think in terms of comparison and contrast, and the very slight changes, if you can find them, between the two writings of the scenes. Also, what are your thoughts on Bean and his true biological family, his relationship to Nikolai, and the future that he has before him?

For next time, next section: Leader.

Ender's Shadow: Scholar

Ok, so we're on week three, and along with Bean's social struggles at Battle School, we're hearing a lot back on earth about Sister Carlotta's search for his parentage. Bean is continuing to be a snoop, he's not playing the mind game, and he's planning to climb through the vents, and he's worrying his teachers, who are desperate enough to call the nun for help. What do you guys think of what Bean finds about the school and what Carlotta finds about Bean? What are your thoughts on the mind game? And what are your thoughts on the fact that Sister Carlotta is so insistent on finding out where Bean came from, and her findings? Once Bean learns of the teachers' mistrust and sets out to be a model student, we find how closely tied he really is to Ender's army and it's success, both as a soldier and as the one who chose his soldiers. Now Bean and Ender's worlds are about to mesh closely for the first time. Has Bean changed yet in his social skills as he strives to emulate Ender? What do you think of Bean's perception of Ender?

For next week, next section: Soldier.

Ender's Shadow: Launchy

Here we are on the second section, and now that Bean is in the same situation Ender once was, so that we can begin to compare and contrast more directly. How does Bean handle being singled out, how does he respond to all the new environments and experiences of the Battle School, and how does he respond to the other children? Most importantly, how does he respond to being compared to Ender, who has already set the stage for brilliance? Personally I find Bean much more engaging than Ender just because he's not quite so malleable and easy to manipulate. Bean stays a step ahead because, naturally, after the way he had to survive on the streets, he finds it difficult to trust anyone, especially adults. In fact, especially when it comes to the desks, he is several steps ahead even of Ender, and he's not afraid of getting in trouble or of being pressed into following the rules to find out what he wants to know. As always, anything anyone wants to mention outside this realm of discussion (I've found some inconsistencies between this and Ender's Game, which is unsurprising, given that there was a ten year gap between them that I like to niggle at) are welcome.

For next week, next section.

Ender's Shadow: Urchin

In the first section of Ender's Shadow, we are introduced to the street life of Rotterdam, the gangs of kids who band together for survival, and most importantly to little Bean, who remarkably has survived, and sees a way to make things better for everyone. We also learn of a very real division between children and adults in this world, the adults who know what's going on, that there are orphans running the streets, fighting for survival, dying, and how few of them, most notably people like the cops, who do so little about it. The prominent figures in Bean's life at the earliest point in the story will continue to affect him as it progresses, so I'd love to hear thoughts on Poke, Achilles, and especially Sister Carlotta. In comparison to Ender, what sort of skills does Bean learn, and how is he affected by events, that you think will contribute to his time in Battle School? And how do you feel thus far about what you've seen of Bean's incredible intellect and memory, how he acted to save his life, and how he views the world thus far? As always, any other thoughts and observations are welcome.

Section 2: Launchy, for next week, and please let me know if the schedule is too demanding for anyone, and we can space out the discussions a bit more.

Ender's Shadow Reading Schedule At Last!

Hey guys, sorry it took me so long to get this post up, I've had a really crazy couple of weeks and am still in the midst of another one. However, with no more ado, here we go.

I figure we can take Ender's Shadow in sections and compare each section with the relative one in Ender's Game, since Ender's Shadow, for those who don't know, is a parallel novel with Bean, one of the boys in Ender's Dragon Army, as the central character. There are six sections to the book, and each one seems to run anywhere between 40 and 70 pages. What I'm proposing is a section a week (or every two weeks, if people prefer) with discussion posts to be made on Friday evenings. So if that works for everyone, we can start on the first section this week, and maybe be close to ready to get initial discussion happening by this Friday, April 2nd, since the first section is one of the shorter ones. Let me know if this works, and if not I'll assume that discussion will go on as scheduled. On to section 1: Urchin.

Ender's Game Final Discussion

We've come to the end of Ender's Game (that is, if you've stuck with me despite the lack of posting discussions, etc), and in this final discussion, anything goes.

One of the things I wanted to discuss was the relationship between Ender and Peter. All throughout the novel, Ender is so afraid of becoming like Peter. And, ironically, Ender is the catalyst for the destruction of an entire race, whereas Peter brings peace to the human race. Do you think Ender becomes what he most fears throughout the novel? Angela brought up the theme of life and death in the last discussion, so we can expand on that here as we discuss the death of the Buggers.

A friend of mine intensely disliked this novel because it involved young children who were controlled, manipulated, and at times abused. I've thought a lot about these things, and it's true that they are disturbing elements in the book. Yet, without them, the book would not be as intense or as captivating as it is. It's because the hope for mankind is found in young children that makes the story so compelling. That the odds are often pitted against them ups the ante even more. But, there are valid points about when is it too far. Is it okay to break a person to save everyone else? What they did to Ender - was that okay? What are your thoughts on the methods used to train Ender, including tricking him into destroying the Buggers? Does the end ever justify the means?

Finally, was what humanity did okay? Was it okay to wipe the Buggers out. Of course, hind sight is 20/20, but did any of you ever question the morality of the decision to strike back when you were reading this novel for the first time? What are your thoughts about the Giant's Drink on the Bugger world and Ender finding the cocoon queen?

If you have any other topics that you wanted to discuss, feel free to add them in the comments section. I've enjoyed reading this book with you and look forward to reading Ender's Shadow next. Angela will be leading that discussion and posting a reading schedule/introduction/something about it in a few days. Thanks, again, for putting up with me. I would never have volunteered to lead the discussion if I had known I would have had such health problems. So, thank you for your patience!